SA Going to NZ Advice Forum

Forum Announcements => Important Announcements => Topic started by: Nolan on October 09, 2009, 10:05:35 pm

Title: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on October 09, 2009, 10:05:35 pm
Guys, I hate to do this but I have deleted some posts which could be seen as immigration advice. The IAA is giving folks running websites lots of uphill and I don't want anything to happen to the site that would cause it to be shut down.

One lady has already been warned about chatting about her own immigration process on her blog HERE (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/technology/news/article.cfm?c_id=5&objectid=10598750)
and the Move2NZ guys have had an official warning / complaint issued against them with has forced them to close down their invaluable Migrant Support Centre in Christchurch as well as cancel their information seminars to the UK (which has always been run with NZIS doing the immigration talk and them doing the settlement talk). The fate of their website still hangs in the balance at this stage. HERE (http://www.smirc.org.nz/)

Feel free to post your progress but please don't ask or answer any questions regarding your application process.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: frodo/maya on October 12, 2009, 06:25:11 am
got it!  :)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: WalJo on October 12, 2009, 08:51:52 am
sorry
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: firefly on October 13, 2009, 08:41:04 am
Ja Baas   ;D ;D  Sorry Baas.  8) 8)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on January 06, 2010, 10:11:41 pm
Guys, I have been deleting too many posts again lately that are asking or giving immigration advice. Every time somebody posts immigration advice they put the whole site at risk of being closed down and myself being prosecuted, which in turn jeopardises my own PR status when I have to apply for an IRRV or citizenship and there is no way in hell I am gonna let anybody do that.

I don't want to or have the energy to start the new year off with a fight, so I have decided to implement a warning system, two strikes and your out.

If you are unsure of whether the answer you are about to add or the question you are about to ask is immigration advice, then rather run it past me first via PM.

A general guideline you can use is : am I asking or answering a question that has anything to do with the blue stickers in my passport? If the answer is yes, then please don't ask or answer the question because it is illegal for you to do so in NZ.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: frodo/maya on January 10, 2010, 10:22:20 am
Got it, sorry of I was guilty .......... if I may ask, if a new member to the forum ask something about going over cowboy and you tell them to do their EOI, is that regarded as advice......... I guess so because then you talk about your blue stickers? Am I right?  :confused:

Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on January 10, 2010, 10:57:47 am
Frodo/Maya, yes that is unfortunately immigration advice as you are advising them about which route is best for them to get their blue stickers in their passport, ie, telling them that in their case it is better to go for PR as opposed to WP.

Information given in general is okay, eg., the articles on what routes are available that I have added to the MyMove section, it becomes advice the minute it becomes "tailored" to a person, ie., an answer to a question or by saying "if you had xyz, you would do abc".

This new law is very vague and frankly stupid and unworkable when it comes to sites like ours, but until somebody with the money can stand up and fight for our freedom of speech. As the webmaster I hang a noose around my neck every time somebody posts immigration advice here, that is why I prefer us to just stay off the topic altogether.  :-\
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: frodo/maya on January 10, 2010, 04:20:58 pm
Thanks Nolan.

 :)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: maanhaarleeu on January 10, 2010, 07:06:39 pm
Hi Nolan,

I agree that hosting this site can put you at great risk. 
I will scrutinise my posts from now on and run it by you if I'm unsure.

Thanks for still keeping it up and running!
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on January 11, 2010, 11:29:14 am
Thanks guys I appreciate it O0
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: firefly on January 11, 2010, 09:53:05 pm
Hi Nolan,
I promise that if we cause you to land in jail, :oops: we will bring you beer and biltong.  :party: :crazy2:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on January 12, 2010, 08:16:27 pm
and bail money  :confused:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: firefly on January 12, 2010, 08:19:00 pm
Nope, sorry can't help you there. ::) but you can sell your butt in jail for bail money  :tongue:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on January 12, 2010, 08:29:28 pm
:-X
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on March 09, 2011, 09:24:55 pm
just bumping this up to remind the new guys
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on August 08, 2011, 11:28:17 am
just bumping this up as a reminder, thanks guys O0
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: jaydenty on August 08, 2011, 11:40:39 am
OMG, I am so so so so so SORRY!!!  :(
 I never meant any harm, I'm new, but been officially warned!!! :-X
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Liezel on August 09, 2011, 05:20:51 am
OMG, I am so so so so so SORRY!!!  :(
 I never meant any harm, I'm new, but been officially warned!!! :-X

I feel that Australia and New Zealand have really little to fear in the world...but themselves.

One of the first things a Saffer needs to understand in either of these two countries is that it is even more PC than you could have imagined. The goverment is essentially much more interested and involved in the day to day lives of people - hence all the new rules and new laws added on a regular basis.

Ever heard Kiwis and Ausies talk about a 'nanny - state' ?
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SA3001 on October 18, 2011, 08:33:54 pm
There seems to be so much confusion about providing immigration advice but this is on the INZ website and to me it looks like you can provide free informal/family advice http://www.immigration.govt.nz/community/stream/advise/whocanadvise.htm

So howcome it's a problem on here?  :confused: :confused:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SaKiwiBoer on October 18, 2011, 10:10:43 pm
So howcome it's a problem on here?  :confused: :confused:

 ???
 :confused:
 :-\
Now that is a good question ?? ??
Aren't we doing it in an informal / family type forum environment?? ??  ::)
I think we are  :whistle:
Don't you??
SAKB
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SA3001 on October 18, 2011, 10:49:01 pm
So howcome it's a problem on here?  :confused: :confused:

 ???
 :confused:
 :-\
Now that is a good question ?? ??
Aren't we doing it in an informal / family type forum environment?? ??  ::)
I think we are  :whistle:
Don't you??
SAKB

That's what I think - surely this is an informal environment similar to a facebook group and there's no joining fee or any money changing hands etc  :help:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: thombatt on October 18, 2011, 11:02:20 pm
..
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on October 18, 2011, 11:34:16 pm
unfortunately a forum like this falls into the "systematically" category. In other words although you may be giving advice to someone now on a "family / casual" basis, you will then do it again tomorrow to help somebody else. The minute you do that, you are providing advice systematically. The law clearly states "irrespective of whether it's for financial gain or not". In other words we can't even help each other for free.

Then there is the fact that the info remains on the site, so anybody can access it, which puts that advice firmly into the "systematic" category.

I hate this new law as much as everybody else as it swept away my livelyhood, that I had planned and worked so hard to achieve for more than 3 years before arriving in NZ - why do you think I have been so scarce on the forum the last 2 odd years? I had to start all over again in a different field  :crazy2:

Worst of all it took away all the awesome help that saved so many folks tens of thousands of Rands in immigration agent fees.

I do see other sites still allowing folks to post immigration advice, but I don't have $100 000 to take that chance? Do you, because according to the law it will not just be me that will be fined, but the person that provided that advice too?

At least we are still able to help in other ways O0
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SaKiwiBoer on October 19, 2011, 01:54:04 am
At least we are still able to help in other ways O0

No problem Nolan. It just looked like there was a whee bit of a chance that we could help each other again.
No probs,
Cheers,
SAKB
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SA3001 on October 19, 2011, 04:08:46 am
No problem, Nolan.  I just wanted to understand 'cause I got shot down on a FB page when I warned them about this.  Is there a link or a source I can point them to?  And how would a person know about this regulation/law because clearly these people know nothing about this?
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Nolan on October 19, 2011, 09:55:35 am
IAA (http://www.iaa.govt.nz/policy-manual/who.html)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SA3001 on October 19, 2011, 08:47:45 pm
Thanks, Nolan.  I've warned them and now it's up to them  O0
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: peterjepwood on May 13, 2013, 12:40:33 am
Hi Guys,
 We now have someone that can answer Immigration Questions who is a licensed adviser.
Regards Peter
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: SA3001 on May 13, 2013, 01:25:02 am
Awesome  :clap: :clap:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Cleo on August 20, 2013, 06:46:09 am
Hi Nolan, I have just joined and posted a question today if a visitor visa can be changed to a work visa or if I should rather apply for a work visa.

My apology if I have overstepped the mark, only saw your request now.

Apology, Claudia Culverwell
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Sherelee on August 26, 2013, 01:25:19 am
Hi Cleo and  :welcome:

No, you haven't overstepped the mark at all. We now have Licensed Immigration Agents from North Shore Immigration Services who can answer your questions.  :yippee: :yippee:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: peterjepwood on September 11, 2013, 06:07:53 am
Good Day,
There is a lot of great information on this site. In fact tons of information & great views on certain subjects. We are now allowed to discuss Immigration on this site as NSIS have 3 licensed immigration advisers and I can assist with jobs on the skills shortage list and point people in the right direction. How you follow through and choose an agent or not is a choice that you have to make.
I am an account and businessman. I used the old Protea Pacific Immigration Agency to come to New Zealand for Visa's etc. I was not prepared to take a chance on such an important matter. So choice. To pay someone money to do a good job is satisfying and takes the angst out of the procedure. Like trying to sell your own home, very few of us do that. Most people I ask, after they have been in New Zealand for a few years, would you have done anything different and 99% of them reply. "I should have come earlier" Good luck with your journey.
Regards,
Peter W
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 11, 2013, 12:52:10 pm
That's what I also hear from people: that they would've made the move sooner if they knew then what they know now. 

The other thing I hear them say, is that they would've done it without the agent.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Adviser on September 11, 2013, 09:59:59 pm
Same old question "why do I need an immigration adviser?"
Why do we need a lawyer or an accountant? It is the same question. If you know what you are doing go ahead and do it.

You may simply not have enough time to research and understand the regulations in sufficient detail to ensure that you will obtain residence or/and any temporary visa.
You may wish to instruct your adviser to ensure you qualify and you obtain the required visas in a timely and stress-free manner.

Immigration is one of the biggest decisions in your life (my for sure) and everything is at stake until you get your residence label in the passport. I did go through the entire process without using any consultant and at the beginning I did too many wrong choices.

I had a recent case when family applied for residence and came to me with quite a nasty letter from Immigration NZ. And my advise was to have that application declined in order to have a right to go to the Tribunal. I won the case.  :coffee:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 12, 2013, 02:06:57 am
Adviser,

Immigration agents provide a valuable service for those who want to or need to, because of time constraints, because their case might be complicated, or whatever. We would be worse off without them.

But it's simply not true that it's all that difficult or dangerous to do it yourself. I did, and I had no problem whatsoever.  All the information I needed was on the government's website.  When we did have questions, Immigration was very approachable and helpful.

To insist on the opposite goes against the spirit that made this forum successful.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Adviser on September 12, 2013, 03:32:07 am
I'm not going to say that it's dangerous and under no circumstances do it yourself.  Filling an application form is easy even though I have seen people coming to me with returned application from Immigration NZ because people attached one photo instead of two. I guess it could be an endless debate.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: vulpes on September 12, 2013, 09:22:29 am
It's not cool to scare people with, well you could do it yourself, but you might stuff it up and there goes your chances! When that's not actually accurate at all. And we had ours come back a couple of times with things not filled out or not attached, we just did as asked and sent it back in, no problem.

INZ are completely transparent. And the process is designed specifically for individuals to do themselves, not for a third party to do on behalf of someone.

I'm not saying there is no place for agents, because they fill a very necessary gap when someone has a difficult or very complicated case and may need someone to advocate for them (which we did in the end) but I know that our case was in the vast minority and was truly unusual. And even though we used an agent, we were also in contact with INZ ourselves directly and never had anything but polite, helpful, easy to understand requests. Not always easy to fulfil!!! But you can't have everything I suppose :-)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: mbl77 on September 12, 2013, 10:03:44 am
We spoke with 2 agents before deciding to do things ourselves. The first was happy to take our money, and the second was honest and said our case was straightforward and he couldn't offer us any significant value. So we did it ourselves.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 12, 2013, 11:30:25 am
It's hard to believe that INZ would turn down an application merely because it had one photo instead of two.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Adviser on September 12, 2013, 11:52:41 am
It's hard to believe that INZ would turn down an application merely because it had one photo instead of two.

It was a failed lodgement application. I'm not saying that it was declined. There are people out there who are scared of actual forms or don't speak any English or.... Or...or.... Hopefully I am not to blame for taking advantage or anything like that... Lets put it that way. I'm going to restaurant to eat some fancy meal even though I can perhaps cook it myself despite paying more money to do so. At the end of the day it is a choice which is great to have.  ;)
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 12, 2013, 11:52:01 pm
That's actually a good metaphor: Going to a restaurant instead of cooking myself.

I would hate not to have the option of going to a restaurant.  But if the cook were to pretend that it would be unhealthy to have a meal at home - that I might actually do myself harm should I try to cook it myself, I wouldn't take him very seriously, would I?  I might still sneak into his joint to see the other people there, but I'd probably avoid his cooking.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: grayburg on September 14, 2013, 01:58:44 am
Informal family advice is fine as well as publicly available information. The IAA are trying to protect vulnerable consumers from an industry with a shocking record of ripping people off (which sadly includes South African "advisers" in SA and here in NZ). The overriding principle in my opinion is for anyone providing advice - even if you think it's friendly and kind - is to realise that someone might be making a massive life changing decision based on your "advice". All too often it turns out the "advice" is not factual and is just a recollection of personal experience or that INZ criteria has changed since our experience or that our criteria are not really the same as the person we are trying so kindly to assist. Equally, people need to realise that gleaning experiences off websites or friends is not a substitute for professional advice. The IAA are now forcing self regulation. If you think about it, this is why every professional usually has professional indemnity insurance - because they are accountable for bad advice. Having said all this the IAA only have teeth in NZ although their mandate says their oversight covers offshore NZ immigration advisors there is currently no way to enforce it except by not accepting applications from non registered advisers. My thoughts don't mean I agree with the new immigration landscape just a window for anyone not sure.
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Adviser on September 16, 2013, 02:14:53 am
That's actually a good metaphor: Going to a restaurant instead of cooking myself.

I would hate not to have the option of going to a restaurant.  But if the cook were to pretend that it would be unhealthy to have a meal at home - that I might actually do myself harm should I try to cook it myself, I wouldn't take him very seriously, would I?  I might still sneak into his joint to see the other people there, but I'd probably avoid his cooking.

I would like to remind you about Japanese way of cooking Fugu. Could be dangerous though  :2funny:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 16, 2013, 03:55:36 am
Ja well no faain, but a lekker snapper would do nobody any harm...   :whistle:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Adviser on September 16, 2013, 05:42:52 am
That's why you go to restaurants sometimes. Fugu is a very delicious fish btw. :smitten:
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: 2GatJakkals on September 16, 2013, 10:19:21 am
Yes, I saw that when I Googled it.  O0
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: Vicky Venter on November 01, 2016, 02:46:51 pm
Hi everyone

We are thinking about the big move to NZ. But our main concern is our financial living. How big wil our drop be when we move?  We dont mind the stepping down on our standerd of luving as long as we know that we can get up to  our current( upper middelclass) standard of living in the future.

My Husband is an Internal Auditor and Im a pre primary teacher.

Any advice on this?
Title: Re: Immigration Advice
Post by: ShaunB on November 01, 2016, 10:21:57 pm
Hi everyone

We are thinking about the big move to NZ. But our main concern is our financial living. How big wil our drop be when we move?  We dont mind the stepping down on our standerd of luving as long as we know that we can get up to  our current( upper middelclass) standard of living in the future.

My Husband is an Internal Auditor and Im a pre primary teacher.

Any advice on this?

Hey Vicky, it will vary quite a bit based on were are going to live. Auckland is expensive, but you can get by with good budgeting principles. With two salaries coming in it should be easier. It also depends on your situation. Day care is really expensive if you have young children, but schooling is not if your kids are school aged. In my opinion and experience, you dont need more money here to have a better quality of life, depends on whats important to you.