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Author Topic: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!  (Read 1410 times)

Offline Jannee

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Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« on: March 28, 2010, 08:05:21 AM »
Hi Everybody

There is always quite a lot of debate on the forum about using immigration agents .....

We have just heard from a friend in SA that they have lost R20,000 to an immigration agent who professed to have offices in UK, Canada, Australia, NZ and an office in Cape Town.  This agency apparently has closed down now (due to bankrupcy!!), and these poor folks have not only lost their money, but their precious original documents.  >:(  They are now trying desperately trying to get their documents back!  :tickedoff:

This is what worries me a great deal about using agents and the very reason why we did not use them.  If you do the immigration process yourself, you have the best control over the whole process and most importantly your documents.  By using an agent, you are at the mercy of a third party and you loose control of your immigration process.  You have to put a lot of trust in them and if things are not looking good their side, they are not going to front up with their clients - they will still take your money and your precious documents and some months later, they may be gone from the scene.

This is not the only scare story I have recently heard.  We have also heard of a couple having to go back to the SA because they had some or other agent who had promised them jobs, and then nothing materialised, so they ended up using all their money and had to go back.

So folks, just be careful when considering agents.  That money spent of them is so precious, believe me.  Not to mention those precious documents!  Please do your homework very thoroughly if you need to use them!

Offline ronaldd

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2010, 09:42:53 AM »
Jannee,  I could not be more eager and louder when I agree with you because in your message there needs to be alot more !!!! and alot of @#$%^&*(  :tickedoff:  :tickedoff:  :tickedoff:

We chose a network of migration agents to handle our stuff but I feel we wasted our money because if it wasnt for my wife nagging,  I would still have been in SA watching paint dry(cross breeding metaphores is not on the skills shortage list)

If you have a good agent,  refer it to friends.  There are some sharks out there.  People who will take your money (34000 in our case) for what is essentially sending 1 international letter.  WE got our own birth certs, doctors forms,  booked our own flights, handled our own accomodation,  filled in our own immigration forms,  did our own EOI.  If we were going to depend on our agents to take care of it... it would have been bad.  If the main person who ran the bussiness was involved throughout as she was at the end,  it would have been easier but we didnt have the most proactive person.  Its really sad considering they were recomended to us.

If i would do it again knowing what i know now,  I would spend 34 000 on a nice holiday or deposit on a house.
2008-04-06 Landed
2008-06-06 Temp WP.
2008-06-17 Submitted EOI
2008-07-16  EOI Selected
2008-12-04 Residence application submitted
2009-03-30 Residence + RRV Granted
2009-04-07 Received our passports back

SA Going to NZ Advice Forum

Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2010, 09:42:53 AM »

Offline Rockhopper

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2010, 09:47:45 PM »
Just an interesting question guys - do you think the new stricter regulations for immigration agents had an impact already?

From what I could read out of Jannee's post, it seems like their are still sharks out there getting away with murder (almost!).  I guess when you declare bankruptcy you sort of don't mind if your agency is suddenly blacklisted, but surely they should have been "registered" in the first place.

I just wander if Immigration NZ had left our little forum alone, we could have meant so much more to so many, instead of ripping people off like the agents do!  Surely access to information should be free!
"Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."
- The White Queen, Alice in Wonderland

Offline mandyh

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2010, 10:10:13 PM »
If my memory serves me correctly the new immigration agent laws took effect here this year for local agents and only next year for agents out of New Zealand.

We also used an agent in Cape Town that definitely didn't earn her monies worth and we were really sorry we paid her all we did.  We should have done it ourselves and saves heaps of money. 


Offline robcraignz

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2010, 11:53:58 PM »
Looked at agents, just didn't think it was worth it all. Being of Scottish descent, thought even less of paying anyone else for substantially less information, than what I got here. Over and above that, this site gave me moral support, a shoulder to lean on, experiential advice of those gone before etc. etc. Did it all by myself, with this ite as guide dog through the maze. O0 O0 O0

Offline Mumtaz (CapetonianInWellington)

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2010, 04:10:19 AM »
I have to agree. We paid R25000 to an agent and we ended up doing ALL the work!!!!!



Offline robcraignz

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2010, 04:15:00 AM »
Ouch, 25k, that really hurts my attitude of a Scotsman, born in Africa, raised in Israel and taught business by an Indian, with deep pockets, short arms and never been able to reach my wife's ahndbag / purse. >:D :angel: :crazy2: :angel:

SA Going to NZ Advice Forum

Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2010, 04:15:00 AM »

Offline Lourens

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2010, 09:01:01 AM »
INZS provides all the info you need, and are quick to respond to specific queries you may have.  You simply make sure all the boxes are ticked, and it really is not difficult.  I am not sure an agent is that valuable, unless you have very unique circumstances, in which case, it may just be better to get a immigration lawyer involved.

Our experience with INZS was very positive.

Cheers.

Offline El

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2010, 09:21:41 AM »
I totally agree with MandyH, the money we paid the agent = R20,000 could have been used better over here.  We did all the work ourselves anyway and the person was not good at following things up etc.  With the 20-20 vision of hindsight we should have done it ourselves. 
The off shore agents have to be registered from May 2010.  Not sure how exactly it would be policed?



Offline CornflakeGirl

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2010, 11:20:12 AM »
Eish, I'm really (well and truely) in two minds about this one. I was adamant from the start that we should do our own thing and skip the agens. But we saw an Auckland-based agent last week (they were out here) and I'm actually considering using them. They have this agent-liscence thing that's required from the 1st of April, so far the only one in SA. Their success rate is 99,6%,  their services are endless and their support seems to be excellent. Trust me, I've done my own homework on them!

The thing that got me thinking was the following: our case is fairly straightforward, we will be applying under the skilled migrant category. We don't have lots of savings, but absolutely no debt. It's simple enough. HOWEVER, 50% of all self-applications under this category are now declined. We've been shown examples of this. Very often the applicant did everything correct on the forms, yet the person at the immigration dept declined the application. It turns out that there is a pretty frequent staff turnoever at the dept of immigration, new employees only have 10 days training. Our application won't necessarily be handled by a "newbie" or declined for that matter, but what if it does? Basically these people have enough contacts in the right places.

Is their contacts worth R25k? I don't know. We haven't figured it all out yet. But if we do use an agent we'll probably go with this lot. They were honest and upfront and managed our expectations in terms of fees, the process, etc. They have 20 years of experience, and for their fee they don't expect us to do any of the paperwork (apart from getting the birth certificates, clearences and medicals).


Offline Hopeful

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2010, 01:07:51 PM »
Just remember - agents don't get preferential treatment at NZIS. So an application sent through an agent and one sent in by yourself will end up in the same queue and be subjected to the same treatment and rules. On this forum I don't think there's anyone with a straightforward application that has been turned down. Some people are stumbling with the medicals, but an agent won't help you there. It's only Marcia that's having a hard time, but she hasn't been turned down. Good luck to NZIS if they do.  :knuppel2: If you actually fill out all the forms yourself it'll make you wonder why on earth would you pay someone R25 000 to do it for you.

Offline Nolan

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2010, 01:13:45 PM »
My 2c from having been on both sides of the coin - doing my own application and starting this site so others can also do it themselves and also having been an agent for a while handling applications for folks that have paid me their hard earned cash to do it for them.

The immigration law is a LOT more complex that what most people realise. It took two reams of paper just to print the operations manual and the act, both of which you need to know intimately to be an good agent or you are gonna mess up big time very quickly. I had been helping folks here on a daily basis with their applications, an answer here and an answer there, but when you have to handle the entire application it is a completely different ball game. You really have to keep your wits about you because one small mistake could cost that family their future.

INZ only know you as a pile of paper on their desk. You could be a stunning bloke or a serial killer and they only have that pile of paper to figure it out. That is why they have such a thick manual and follow it to the letter. There really are many twists and turns and each persons case is different even though they, at face value, look the same. When dealing with immigration you have to dot all the i's and cross all the t's before they will give you your PR sticker. If they have only the slightest doubt, you have a problem. I don't know of anybody that didn't have comebacks or extra requests before their application was approved.

Having said all that, here is my personal opinion and as we cannot give immigration advice by law, i add a disclaimer here - this is not immigration advice, it is simply my opinion of whether to use an agent or not, and then go and do your own research and make your own informed decision  :

If you have a straight forward case, ie., no health issues, enough qualifications, no criminal record, and all the things that INZ wants from you, plus you have lots of time to study all the parts of the law that pertain to your case, then it is possible to do it yourself. You take a huge risk doing that.

On the other hand you have a double edged sword called an agent:

An agent has the difficult task of figuring out who you are and your whole life history without knowing you and then he needs to be able to tell you what documents he needs from that info. Try doing that with one of your immigrant buddies just for the fun of it and you'll soon notice it isn't an easy task.

Bad agent - will take on any case thrown at him, doesn't know the law, doesn't take the time to ensure that he has asked you for and submitted all the documents for your case and doesn't have a 100% money back guarantee for when it all goes pear shaped. There are still too many of them out there, despite the new IAA law unfortunately.

Good agent - will only take on a case he knows he will win and will tell you if you ain't gonna make it or what other options are available to you. A good agent knows the law and will double and triple check that he has everything in place before sending in your application. A good agent also brings another important factor to the table that you can't - experience. He will in all likelyhood have dealt with a few cases similar to yours, plus many others that are not so will know what is required to get your application processed smoothly. He will know what INZ is pedantic about and ensure that you supply enough information in that area. He also has his finger on the trigger as far as all the little changes that INZ constantly make, and believe me they are CONSTANTLY changing the rules. Changes that you can easily miss if you are not "in the game" every day.

INZ themselves are also not that jacked up either - I had one case which was textbook guaranteed success where the CO rejected the application off the bat, even quoting from the manual why the application was rejected and I had to use all my experience and knowledge of the law to prove the CO was wrong. If the person did it themselves, they would in all likelyhood have thought they couldn't apply and would still be in SA today. I had another case where a customer came to me after their application had been rejected. I put in a new application for the customer and it sailed through - the difference between it sailing through when I did it as opposed to the previous time was a single word on the employment contract that made the difference between approved and rejected.

Before going the DIY route you need to ask yourself : do I have the time and ability to trawl through the law if something goes wrong.

Before going the agent route you need to ask yourself : can I afford the agent and am I not just too lazy to do this myself. Then you need to ask the agent what he will do for you when things go wrong like does he have a 100% money back guarantee, does the fee include an appeal if your case is rejected or is that extra. Those are little tell tale signs that the agent may be in it just for the money.

Agent fees - Agents charge a lot of money yes, but if they are good, it's for a good reason. Just like a lawyer, you are not so much paying them for the physical work they do, but for their experience, knowledge and their ability to apply that knowledge. Handling somebody's immigration application is so much more than just collecting a few documents from them, filling in a form and posting it off, believe me. Just the stress of knowing that you have a families future hanging in the balance if you make a single mistake is no fun and in my opinion not worth the money.

If you are up for murder you won't plead your own case would you? You would find the best lawyer you can afford.

Why plead your own immigration case when your whole family's future is at stake?

The only reason is usually because of the money, i know that is why i did my own application as opposed to paying an agent. If i had the money i would have happily paid an agent. Would I have complained afterwards that he did nothing, yet I am sitting with PR in NZ? Probably yes

SA Going to NZ Advice Forum

Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2010, 01:13:45 PM »

Offline robcraignz

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2010, 01:41:18 AM »
And the case for the prosecution and defence rests, your honour. Man, if ever there was a comprehensive answer to the dilemma, I think that was and is it. See, this site has all the information you would ever need. Nolan makes perfect sense on every front. Suppose circumstance is the governor of the direction / option taken. If you have a job offer, how long you are prepared to wait etc. etc. O0

Offline Durbschick1

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2010, 06:46:47 AM »
I cannot agree more about NOT using an agent... not an SA based one anyway. My sister in law used an Auckland based one and it was a dream. Everything handled perfectly and professionally. We used one in JHB... most money (R20,000) we ever paid for BAD service! We ended up doing everything ourselves. They send my DH a completed Work Permit Application full of spelling mistakes and heaps of other errors. All they have done for us was SAPS clearances....



Offline tmprince

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Re: Immigration Agents - Tread with care, guys!!
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2010, 07:38:10 AM »
ok as I have been used as an egsample on this thread let me say we did all our own stuff and I read the WHOLE FORUM ,but ended up with a newbie that was sticking by the manual and not budging so I now have an immigration lawyer on my side as I was starting to take her nitpicking personally and was planning some horrible things  :knuppel2: >:D so before I was arrested I got Eden involved and althoughe it was still up to me to loose weight and sort out a few things the stress levels eased off cause it did not feel like a personal attack everytime I submitted anything and he also gave us other angles that we had not thought off so 6 of these and 1/2 a dozen of those WE WILL GET TO NZ ! So what ever you decide it must be for your ultimate benifit  and goodluck in your endevours.
Lovies
Marcia
EOI submitted   13-01-09
EOI selected     28-01-09
ITA recieved     09-02-09
ITA submitted   24-06-09
ITA lodged       26-06-09
CO assigned     28-09-09
WTR approved  14-05-2010
Arrived 01-07-2010
PR March 2011

 

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